From:   shaista husain <>
Sent time:   Friday, November 04, 2011 8:26:57 AM
Subject:   Re: [september17discuss] Re: way cool infographic on the demographics of OWS,


It was not about resentment i don't have resentment--let me explain to

you--I actually believed harrison and grim made this racist graph,

they claimed, prior to this chart, I was under the impression they

conducted this research because they bragged about it previously.

Obviously we know now they did not because they couldn't answer any

questions about it, but they presented this data as if they did it.

So who takes ownership of this "official demographic" on MoveOn's "WHO



i criticized the methodology three times before, each time harrison

and grim presented it: 1. it was about actual people at Liberty

Square, and 2. regarding "university outreach' for people of color

(*what a sack of cynical lies) Harrison and Grim team--so concerned

with lack of people of color representation! Wow. I never "called"

them out on racism the previous times i took issue with the

methodology of this "research" but when i saw this finished chart--it

was obvious to me it was totally fabricated, obscurantist and

illustrative of a lack of basic methodology and lacking any

understanding of how to present empirical demographic data. One quick

look at the top of the chart and the "81% white majority" is the main

point of this chart, everything else is a subnarrative to make it

appear professional. Not 80% no, its 81%. LOL> But i can't get past

the white majority bullshit because i need to know what this flyer is

for? --Lauren jumped in valiantly in its defense "it is not official"

its from internet feedback its unscientific--"this is america"



LOOKING pseudo-Census? The degree of propaganda here and manipulation

of data is just preposterous. No one even knew what the flyer was

for--harrison wanted me to take this "useful" information he worked so

hard at, to the PoC working group! It gets even more cynical--hey

guys, let's put some ethnic sounding professor's name to endorse this

and voila you have your "expert" and we can pass this off highly

complex academic research. Grim and Harrison and Lauren, the "experts"

and Gabriel joined in the frat club parroting off about my



I knew that i would be attacked personally because no one else here

seems to address racism or question it. Racist people simply do not

have the intellectual capacity to self examine anything, and by

revealing their own racism by calling the other person names you are

"irrational" Rob Hollander chimed in to give Grim the green light,

yeah shaista shouldn't have called anyone racist, as if he, a white

man, is a professional on racism too and he gets to decide what is

racist or not. Usually when i want to make an intervention i ask my

white allies to do it, for the sake of escaping the racist attacks

against me. As you know Cesar, i often just talk to you or someone

else because i know as soon as "certain people" will see my name they

will either go bonkers, be threatened like Grim, or dismiss me like

Rob. In the end, Grim wants to pretend she had nothing to do with

this--just talk to Fast Company. Well why didn't you say that from the



Such low honesty and such ignorance and mean spirited people --its

enough to make me want to leave. Yes Grim and Harrison you showed your

true colors. nasty people --what does it take a quick minute to say

hey, yeah this propaganda was for MoveON and we don't agree with how

this was manipulated, we agree with you shaista. NO --that would mean

they had brains for self reflection. They don't.


81% white majority is not the way OWS has identified itself or should.

WE ARE NOT MOVEON !!!! The framing of this kind of demographic data as

"super-cool" also illustrates total lack of intelligence. A corporate

looking chart without any anti-oppression agenda or any concern for

the accuracy or any sense of critical reflection about the information

is obvious to anyone with a high school diploma. Provide some

clarification before passing this information off as "official

looking" hubris. The authority with which they seem to accept their

authority shows the level of chauvinistic conceit and thuggery common

to a boys locker room. The refusal to acknowledge or see diversity is

racist. The total lack of concern about these issues is racist. The

dismissal of my contribution here is racist and finally the total lack

of accountability to nasty words and their inability to show any

reflection or correction is dangerous and racist. Racist people just

don't give a fuck--they will attack me because it is a way to hide

themselves from any scrutiny and pass off as "correct" YOU WIN GUYS

but anyone reading this thread can see who these people really are. I

don't expect them to apologize and Rob hollander has decided for all

of us, an apology is not needed. Rob, you simply don't get the kind of

hate and dismissal because you are part of the problem, as a white man

you are not targeted nor have any experience. So no i don't have

resentment, i am aware how ignorant and mean people can be and i am a

revolutionary so I am not going to stop fighting the racists. They

will either change or they will go down with the bankers and the whole

system. To me, having racist people in this movement is a bigger

problem than any other.






On Fri, Nov 4, 2011 at 9:18 AM, Winter Siroco <> wrote:

> ...together and ignoring our internal problems and the insults that we

> inflict upon each other, and let's throw a few under the truck, some will

> survive.

> Cesar


> On Thu, Nov 3, 2011 at 3:57 PM, rob hollander <> wrote:


>> It might have been more useful to release just the jobs, college, income

>> and age data alone which show that it's the opposite of a bunch of

>> unemployed kids: it's mostly people over 25, either gainfully employed,

>> though underpaid, or trying to improve themselves in college, many of whom

>> are both in school and working full time (at least 7% and quite possibly

>> much more -- it's not explicit from the chart).


>> But the graphic as it is has no methodology, no background, minimal

>> explanation, no example of the survey questionnaire, no effort to make any

>> point with the data. I'd have to say the graphic qualifies as flaunting.


>> Ah, well, the movement will survive. I'm with grim here -- learn from our

>> mistakes and missed opportunities, but by all means let's keep moving

>> forward together.




>> On Thu, Nov 3, 2011 at 3:12 PM, Jon Good <> wrote:


>>> ...fuck.





>>> On Nov 3, 2011, at 2:47 PM, shaista husain <>

>>> wrote:


>>> > And here it is JUST AS I THOUGHT --the official release---the

>>> > demographic data of OWS ---released by MoveON!!!! yes you guessed

>>> > it--the same folk we were taking about

>>> >

>>> >

>>> > On Thu, Nov 3, 2011 at 2:01 PM, shaista husain

>>> > <> wrote:

>>> >> Thanks Grim- for calling me irrational. i think my writing is self

>>> >> evident---please be the change you want to see in the world.

>>> >> I still offer you some herbs for healing....

>>> >> peace

>>> >> shaista

>>> >>

>>> >>

>>> >> On Thu, Nov 3, 2011 at 1:17 PM, gwomyn <> wrote:

>>> >>> I have published the email thread as a public document if anyone

>>> >>> would

>>> >>> like to read it: after Shaista sent me an

>>> >>> invitation to meet I made a mistaken assumption. Regardless, I have

>>> >>> no

>>> >>> wish to engage with a person who has spoken to myself and others with

>>> >>> such irrationality.

>>> >>>

>>> >>> On Nov 3, 11:50 am, shaista husain <> wrote:

>>> >>>> Being defined as an arab, by Lauren, then told that arabs are

>>> >>>> actually

>>> >>> I have personal

>>> >>>> threats from Grim "privately" sent to me, which i shall spare at the

>>> >>>> moment--and really really disturbing threats. Perhaps this is the

>>> >>>> reason why i have been so "edgy" and emotional and paranoid, when

>>> >>>> someone tries to silence you by threatening to turn you over to the

>>> >>>> police:

>>> >>>

>>> >>




>> --

>> Rob Hollander

>> Lower East Side Residents for Responsible Development


>> 622 E 11, #10

>> NYC, 10009

>> 212-228-6152