Subject: Re: [GlobalRevolutionMedia] Re: [september17discuss] WINTER ATLIBERTY PLAZA
From: "=?utf-8?B?cGV0ZXJAZm90b2pvdXJuYWxpc20ubmV0?=" <peter@fotojournalism.net>
Date: Tue, 01 Nov 2011 11:40:32 -0400
To: globalrevolutionmedia@googlegroups.com

Nice I'd like to be involved as I've done some winter camping stuff cheers Peter

----- Reply message -----
From: "Victoria Sobel" <victoria@showpaper.org>
To: <globalrevolutionmedia@googlegroups.com>
Subject: [GlobalRevolutionMedia] Re: [september17discuss] WINTER ATLIBERTY PLAZA
Date: Tue, Nov 1, 2011 11:27


sounds great nicholas!

On Sun, Oct 30, 2011 at 10:49 PM, Nicholas Isabella <captainnick07@gmail.com
> wrote:

> I have been reading these threads all day and feel like i should chime in.
> I have been working over the past 2 weeks a very detailed document on how
> to prepare for the winter weather. It covers EVERYTHING we need to
> know..how to dress,how to eat, etc...I dont know if it will be helpful or
> not but check it out. I also would like to know about the cold weather
> committee, i heard this being thrown around last week but not sure if it
> happened. As a big weather guy, id love to be a part of this, if it does
> not exist i would personally create it. This group can work along side with
> comfort,medical,and finance to have a plan put in place. If we are going to
> try and stay in the park throughout the winter we need a solid plan. The
> last page of this document is a SPECIFIC checklist with cold weather gear
> we may need. Ofcourse all donations are welcomed but at this point in the
> season we should as for the items listed on the list to better address the
> concerns that have been brought up in this email thread. Winterization
> Guide/Checklist<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1oWOZ2_QF7t6fdEgcDKFdnzI0Xt_uCagtCXsMAGtdbpg/edit?hl=en_US>
>
>
> On Sun, Oct 30, 2011 at 2:57 PM, Nikolas Gelormino <ngelormino@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> bottom line, based on my one night of sleeping in the sleet and snow:
>> tents and waterproofing are what the issue is. Except in the absolute worst
>> conditions, you could sleep in your underwear in a well sealed tent and
>> remain safely warm. I commend those who braved the weather with far less
>> than I brought, but realistically if the issue is staying healthy and safe
>> then you can't just rely on your courage and dedication.
>>
>> People may not even realize how serious it can be to be underprepared in
>> cold weather. I can't make it to a working group tonight but I think there
>> may even be a need to propose some sort of safety announcement before
>> people hunker down every night. The young, or inexperienced may think its
>> only their own health at risk but we must care for each other too and
>> acknowledge that sickness or worse in the winter could be a very
>> unfortunate for our image and momentum.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 30, 2011 at 2:46 PM, <tim@timothyeastman.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I've read reviews on these shirts bc I thought they seemed pretty good,
>>> and supposedly they are somewhat warming but really not so super-warming as
>>> the ads might lead you to believe. I haven't actually worn them though so I
>>> can't speak from experience, maybe there are some people who own these
>>> shirts who could say more about them. Just in case that helps...
>>> Tim
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, 30 Oct 2011 13:29:19 -0500, anya <sunmoonpluto@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Huh? the body-heating shirts on EACH person on the plaza doesn't adress
>>> the issue? and 4K is what - 2% of the donation pool - are you serious? this
>>> i exactly why we are not ready for the winter - people seem to have hard
>>> times embracing simple and effective solutions... and int this particular
>>> case also a technologically advances solution - the shirts i am talking
>>> about are made out of a fancy Japanese material that turns your sweat into
>>> heat - and they JUST started selling them in USA this October -  i just
>>> can't wrap my head around how it is NOT addressing the winter issues!?
>>>
>>>
>>>> 2011/10/30 Nikolas Gelormino <ngelormino@gmail.com>
>>>>
>>>>      proposing these ideas over email is one thing. actually sitting
>>>> down with a working group and putting together a proposal and a budget is
>>>> another thing.
>>>>
>>>> tshirts arent the only means of keeping warm and dry. that seems like
>>>> $4000 spent on something that wouldnt even address the real issue of winter
>>>> coming.
>>>> On Sun, Oct 30, 2011 at 2:02 PM, anya <sunmoonpluto@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>      my question is WHERE those hundreds of thousands of dollars
>>>> are??? Who has them and how are they being distributed? I mean..
>>>> the square receives ~10K a day in donations.. where do they go to?!
>>>> When i stayed on the square there were no sleeping bags even available
>>>> and i got sick eventually.
>>>>
>>>> I want to see the transparent budget distribution for the donations and
>>>> see people just go to the UNIGLO store and buy 200 of these Tshirts:
>>>> http://www.uniqlo.com/us/**CPaGoods/itemcode=069409<http://www.uniqlo.com/us/CPaGoods/itemcode=069409>
>>>> they heat you up as you sweat and they are only
>>>> $20  each. I was trying to figure out how to get this shirts to the
>>>> square already for a MONTH!!! the ways you, guys there interact with the
>>>> outside world and handle donations is just a mess. Please, get organized -
>>>> and go buy the fucking shirts!
>>>>
>>>> anya
>>>>
>>>> 2011/10/30 Victoria Sobel <victoria@showpaper.org>
>>>>
>>>>      please understand its not a issue of financial organization- this
>>>> is a larger overarching problem of how groups need to form budgets. not
>>>> just budgets for onetime large purchases ( and many groups are buying
>>>> simply on a need basis) but also a re-occuring (weekly/monthly) basis with
>>>> the understanding that we as an occupation might incur emergencies like
>>>> yesterday.  so to answer your question in general comfort has enough socks-
>>>> but when hit with weather like yesterday we blew through those reserves in
>>>> a way that they needed to be kept from being fully depleted. finance just
>>>> released a packet that has all of this information- it is not responsible
>>>> to making any judgement calls on whether or not groups receive or ask for
>>>> money it is more realistically a book-keeping committee meant to organize
>>>> spending/fundraising/asset trends and report them back. it wasnt really
>>>> possible to do this until recently because none of the trends had
>>>> normalized in a way that would have been beneficial to look at. On Sun, Oct
>>>> 30, 2011 at 12:52 PM, anya <sunmoonpluto@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>      I don't understand - the plaza has collected something int the
>>>> range of 200,000 dollars? why do i still see things like: we need
>>>> socks!!!!! what's wrong with the financial organization?
>>>>
>>>> 2011/10/30 Christian Smith-Socaris <c.smith.socaris@gmail.com>
>>>>
>>>>        +1
>>>>
>>>> On 10/30/2011 12:08 PM, Nikolas Gelormino wrote:       I slept at
>>>> zuccotti last night and I was prepared so it wasn't bad at all. this was my
>>>> first night and I set up around 11pm in the snow/rain.  three important
>>>> things to establish are:
>>>>
>>>>  -staying dry: you need to have a tent with a fly or really well
>>>> anchored tarp. if youre getting wet, you will get very cold and you wont be
>>>> able to bring up your body temperature naturally.
>>>>  -keep warm air in: your body creates heat so trap it in. again, the
>>>> fly or tarp works with this. eliminate breezes and drafts as much as
>>>> possible. it sounds silly and excessive but a tent within a tent is another
>>>> way to trap the heat in by creating two layers of air.
>>>>  -keep distance off the floor: if you have a mat, or tarp or anything
>>>> to buffer the coldness of the ground you will be much warmer.
>>>>  artificial heating elements will do little if you don't try to
>>>> establish these basics. the less we rely on gas powered energy the less we
>>>> will need to spend, the less we will be reliant on the city's "permitting"
>>>> us to run these generators. it might seem wasteful to spend the money on
>>>> good tents and sleeping bags but you save in the long run because they work
>>>> way better to keep out water and keep in your body heat.
>>>>  just some thoughts from my camping experience.
>>>>  -n
>>>>
>>>>  -
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Oct 30, 2011 at 7:02 AM, Cari Machet <carimachet@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>      battery heated options:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.amazon.com/Qfiber-**Body-Wrap-Portable-Powered/dp/**
>>>> B002J9P31G<http://www.amazon.com/Qfiber-Body-Wrap-Portable-Powered/dp/B002J9P31G>
>>>>
>>>> http://www.beurer.com/web/en/**product/flexible_heating/**
>>>> special_heating_pads/special_**heating_pads.php<http://www.beurer.com/web/en/product/flexible_heating/special_heating_pads/special_heating_pads.php>
>>>>
>>>> http://www.globalindustrial.**com/c/work-benches/mats-**
>>>> carpets/heated?infoParam.**campaignId=T9A&gclid=**
>>>> CNaA5PuAkKwCFUZd5QodiG-Aow<http://www.globalindustrial.com/c/work-benches/mats-carpets/heated?infoParam.campaignId=T9A&gclid=CNaA5PuAkKwCFUZd5QodiG-Aow>
>>>>
>>>> http://www.globalindustrial.**com/g/work-benches/mats-**
>>>> carpets/heated/heattrak-snow-**ice-melting-walkway-mats<http://www.globalindustrial.com/g/work-benches/mats-carpets/heated/heattrak-snow-ice-melting-walkway-mats>
>>>>
>>>> http://www.globalindustrial.**com/g/work-benches/mats-**
>>>> carpets/heated/powerblanket-**multi-duty-thawing-blankets<http://www.globalindustrial.com/g/work-benches/mats-carpets/heated/powerblanket-multi-duty-thawing-blankets>
>>>>
>>>> http://www.activeforever.com/**p-25680-venture-heat-heated-**
>>>> stadium-seat-cushion.aspx?cm_**mmc=froogle-_-na-_-venture-**
>>>> heat-heated-stadium-seat-**cushion-_-50464<http://www.activeforever.com/p-25680-venture-heat-heated-stadium-seat-cushion.aspx?cm_mmc=froogle-_-na-_-venture-heat-heated-stadium-seat-cushion-_-50464>
>>>>
>>>> http://cozywinters.com/shop/**bench-warmer.html<http://cozywinters.com/shop/bench-warmer.html>
>>>>
>>>> http://cozywinters.com/**battery-heated-clothing.html<http://cozywinters.com/battery-heated-clothing.html>
>>>>
>>>> On 10/30/11, Bruce Wagner <bruce@onlyonetv.com> wrote:
>>>> > For those who've been down there tonight, how would you say people are
>>>> > holding up?
>>>> > On Oct 29, 2011 5:10 PM, "Andrea Ciannavei" <
>>>> andrea.ciannavei@gmail.com>
>>>> > wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> is there an email list for any churches/synagogues/mosques that
>>>> support
>>>> >> OWS. maybe they can open their churches or event spaces for people
>>>> to be?
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> On Oct 29, 2011, at 5:07 PM, beka economopoulos wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Agreed, the "ask" is not "please come to Liberty Park" -- we don't
>>>> need
>>>> >> bodies there as much as we need:
>>>>
>>>>  >> *
>>>> >> 1) Please drop off winter gear donations needed, as outlined in the
>>>> list
>>>>
>>>>  >> below. * (I don't understand what the problem with dropping off
>>>> stuff at
>>>> >> the UFT building is - that has been the OWS storage space for several
>>>> >> weeks
>>>> >> now, it is where everything is being stored and sorted and it is
>>>> where we
>>>> >> need materials ASAP.  If that is a big problem please go straight to
>>>> the
>>>> >> Comfort Station inside the park, but that effs up our systems a bit,
>>>> >> better
>>>> >> to go to OWS storage space at 52 Broadway. >>
>>>>
>>>>  >> *2) Plan for opening up homes or indoor spaces for folks to sleep
>>>> >> tonight.  *I'm not on this...anyone else?  Status update?
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Also: if materials can't be donated today/tonight, or tomorrow, they
>>>> can
>>>> >> be shipped (or purchased and arranged delivery) to this address:
>>>> >>
>>>>
>>>>  >> *Shipping address:*
>>>> >> 118a Fulton St
>>>> >> PO Box 205
>>>> >> NY NY 10038
>>>> >>
>>>>
>>>>  >> *Dropping off in person:*
>>>> >> Daily until 9pm at the United Federation of Teachers building, ground
>>>> >> floor, 52 Broadway Ave. >> After 9pm at the OWS Comfort Station on
>>>> the east side of Liberty Square
>>>> >> (aka Zuccotti Park)
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 4:56 PM, Victoria Sobel
>>>> >> <victoria@showpaper.org>wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> marissa i think more than getting people down here we need a solid
>>>> plan
>>>> >>> for where to put people tonight. ive been here all day and we'll be
>>>> fine
>>>> >>> but i have very SERIOUS concerns for a majority of the park that is
>>>> not
>>>> >>> as
>>>> >>> well prepared. yes we do need all those supplies but moreso we need
>>>> to
>>>> >>> start moving bodies. there will be enough people hold the space. >>>
>>>> >>> On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 4:41 PM, beka economopoulos <
>>>> >>> beka@notanalternative.net> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>>
>>>>  >>>> *Hi, here is a list of urgent needs:*
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> -* insulated gloves, wool hats, scarves
>>>> >>>> - long underwear / smart wool thermal socks
>>>> >>>> - 300 hand warmers, 300 foot warmers
>>>> >>>> - waterproof boots in all sizes
>>>> >>>> - disposable shoe covers
>>>> >>>> - winter coats
>>>> >>>> - hot beverages
>>>> >>>> - thermal heaters
>>>> >>>> - all weather sub-thermal sleeping bags
>>>> >>>> - tarps
>>>> >>>> - insulating tents; foam padding for inside of tents
>>>> >>>> - wooden pallets to get tents off the ground
>>>>
>>>>  >>>> - cots to get people off the ground*
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> It sounds like we have plywood for pallets and some tarps lined up
>>>> for
>>>> >>>> today.  Have 160 sub-zero sleeping bags that were just delivered
>>>> today
>>>>
>>>>  >>>> *but
>>>> >>>> need more*!  The hand warmers and foot warmers would be greatly
>>>> >>>> appreciated ASAP.  Winter gear, waterproof boots of all sizes,
>>>> >>>> disposable
>>>> >>>> shoe covers, mens/women's long underwear, cots are all needed. >>>>
>>>>
>>>>  >>>> *Items can be dropped off today and tomorrow (or all week) until
>>>> 9pm at
>>>> >>>> 52 Broadway where we have ground floor storage in the United
>>>> Federation
>>>> >>>> of
>>>> >>>> Teachers building. >>>>
>>>> >>>> After 9pm donations can go to the Comfort station on the east side
>>>> of
>>>>
>>>>  >>>> Liberty Park (aka zuccotti park).  *
>>>>  >>>>
>>>> >>>> Thanks,
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Beka
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 4:21 PM, acpollack2@juno.com <
>>>> >>>> acpollack2@juno.com> wrote:
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>> shovels?
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>> ---------- Original Message ----------
>>>> >>>>> From: Marisa Holmes <marisaholmes@gmail.com>
>>>> >>>>> To: september17@googlegroups.com
>>>> >>>>> Subject: Re: [september17discuss] WINTER AT LIBERTY PLAZA
>>>> >>>>> Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2011 23:19:47 +0300
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>> People Need the Following:
>>>> >>>>>  Emergency Blankets
>>>> >>>>> Dry Socks, Gloves, and Hats
>>>> >>>>> Payless gift certificates for Shoes
>>>> >>>>> Towels
>>>> >>>>> Plastic Bins
>>>> >>>>> 3 post tents
>>>> >>>>> In solidarity,�
>>>> >>>>> Marisa
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>> 2011/10/29 Conor Tom�Reed <conortomasreed@gmail.com>
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>>> Big ditto to Marisa's call, but let's also be sure to notify the
>>>> camp
>>>> >>>>>> that this is only a brief snow-flash. Next week will get warmer,
>>>> so
>>>> >>>>>> we'll
>>>> >>>>>> have some time to figure out winter plans. >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>> http://www.weather.com/**weather/tenday/USNY0996<http://www.weather.com/weather/tenday/USNY0996>
>>>> >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>> snow solidarity!
>>>> >>>>>> -Conor
>>>> >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>> On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 4:12 PM, Marisa Holmes <
>>>> marisaholmes@gmail.com
>>>> >>>>>> > wrote:
>>>> >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>> Hi everyone!
>>>> >>>>>>> There is urgent support needed at Liberty Plaza.�
>>>> >>>>>>> Winter has hit hard, and it is cold and wet.�
>>>> >>>>>>> The occupiers request that everyone come�
>>>> >>>>>>> as soon as possible to help with the transition.�
>>>> >>>>>>> Reach out to your networks.�
>>>> >>>>>>> This is a crucial turning point in the struggle.�
>>>> >>>>>>> I have been at home in front of my computer,�
>>>> >>>>>>> but I'm going back to streets.�
>>>> >>>>>>> I hope to see you there.�
>>>> >>>>>>> In solidarity,�
>>>> >>>>>>> Marisa�
>>>> >>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> --
>>>> >>>> Watch our new Kickstarter video!
>>>> >>>> http://kickstarter.com/**projects/naa/nospace<http://kickstarter.com/projects/naa/nospace>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Not An Alternative
>>>> >>>> http://notanalternative.com
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Fission Strategy
>>>>
>>>>  >>>> http://fissionstrategy.com*
>>>> >>>> *
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Phone: 917-202-5479
>>>> >>>> Skype: bekamop
>>>> >>>> Twitter: http://twitter.com/bekamop
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> --
>>>> >> Watch our new Kickstarter video!
>>>> >> http://kickstarter.com/**projects/naa/nospace<http://kickstarter.com/projects/naa/nospace>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Not An Alternative
>>>> >> http://notanalternative.com
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Fission Strategy
>>>>
>>>>  >> http://fissionstrategy.com*
>>>>  >> *
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Phone: 917-202-5479
>>>> >> Skype: bekamop
>>>> >> Twitter: http://twitter.com/bekamop
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Andrea Ciannavei
>>>> >> andrea.ciannavei@gmail.com
>>>> >> 646-326-4896
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>  --
>>>> Cari Machet
>>>> NYC 646-436-7795
>>>> carimachet@gmail.com
>>>> AIM carismachet
>>>> Skype carimachet - 646-652-6434
>>>> Syria +963-099 277 3243
>>>> Amman +962 077 636 9407
>>>> Twitter: @carimachet <https://twitter.com/**carimachet<https://twitter.com/carimachet>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> -- Anna Petrova
>>>>
>>>> "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to
>>>> do nothing. "~  Edmund Burke
>>>> "Disillusionment is always a wrack. Especially when Illusions are so
>>>> sanguine and happy"  ~  phy
>>>> "They call it 'American Dream' because you have to be asleep to believe
>>>> it"  ~  George Carlin"A goal without a plan is just a wish."  ~  Antoine de
>>>> Saint-Exupery
>>>> "Life can only be understood backwards, but it must be lived forwards"
>>>> ~  Soren Kierkgaard. "If you do nothing there is one thing we can promise
>>>> you, nothing will happen."  ~  Jacque Fresco
>>>>
>>>> -- Anna Petrova
>>>>
>>>> "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to
>>>> do nothing. "~  Edmund Burke
>>>> "Disillusionment is always a wrack. Especially when Illusions are so
>>>> sanguine and happy"  ~  phy
>>>> "They call it 'American Dream' because you have to be asleep to believe
>>>> it"  ~  George Carlin"A goal without a plan is just a wish."  ~  Antoine de
>>>> Saint-Exupery
>>>> "Life can only be understood backwards, but it must be lived forwards"
>>>> ~  Soren Kierkgaard. "If you do nothing there is one thing we can promise
>>>> you, nothing will happen."  ~  Jacque Fresco
>>>>
>>>> -- Anna Petrova
>>>>
>>>> "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to
>>>> do nothing. "~  Edmund Burke
>>>> "Disillusionment is always a wrack. Especially when Illusions are so
>>>> sanguine and happy"  ~  phy
>>>> "They call it 'American Dream' because you have to be asleep to believe
>>>> it"  ~  George Carlin"A goal without a plan is just a wish."  ~  Antoine de
>>>> Saint-Exupery
>>>> "Life can only be understood backwards, but it must be lived forwards"
>>>> ~  Soren Kierkgaard. "If you do nothing there is one thing we can promise
>>>> you, nothing will happen."  ~  Jacque Fresco
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
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