From:   Michael Friedman <lycophidion@gmail.com>
Sent time:   Wednesday, October 05, 2011 7:15:21 AM
To:   september17@googlegroups.com
Subject:   SPAM-MED: [september17discuss] So Real it Hurts - Notes on Occupy Wall Street: Manissa McCleave Maharawal on struggling with racism
 

http://www.leftturn.org/so-real-it-hurts-notes-occupy-wall-street

 

So Real it Hurts - Notes on Occupy Wall Street

By:

Manissa McCleave Maharawal

Date Published:

October 4, 2011

 

I first went down to Occupy Wall Street last Sunday, almost a week

after it had started. I didn't go down before because I, like many of

my other brown friends, was wary of what we had heard or just intuited

that it was mostly a young, white male scene. When I asked friends

about it they said different things: that it was really white; that it

was all people they didn't know; and that they weren't sure what was

going on. But after hearing about the arrests and police brutality on

Saturday, September 24th and after hearing that thousands of people

had turned up for their march I decided I needed to see this thing for

myself.

[.....]

 

 

 

 

Michael Friedman, Ph.D.

Visiting Scientist

Sackler Institute for Comparative Genomics

American Museum of Natural History

79th Street and Central Park West

New York, NY 10024

Cell: 718-812-4246

 

 

 

 

 

On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 6:32 PM, <september17@googlegroups.com> wrote:

>   Today's Topic Summary

>

> Group: http://groups.google.com/group/september17/topics

>

> Sound Permit [2 Updates]

> Direct Participatory Democratic Network - Where Revolution Streches in the

> Horizon [5 Updates]

> OccupyWallStreet Economic Statement Draft 1 [3 Updates]

> Propaganda [2 Updates]

> The PR company I told you was "representing" OWS Fwd: Workhouse PR [3

> Updates]

> persons running wearethe99percent.tumblr.com [1 Update]

> Welcome Flyer [1 Update]

> Wall Street is War Street: Antiwar rally on Sat, Oct 15 moved to OWS [5

> Updates]

> Miami Herald - Phone interview - TODAY [2 Updates]

> URGENT: Safer Spaces and Non-violence [1 Update]

>

>  Topic: Sound Permit

>

> jemcgloin@verizon.net Oct 04 04:42PM -0500 ^

>

> Here's an article about the power of the human mic. I also think the human

> mic is part of our magic and I think we should keep it.

>

> http://www.thenation.com/blog/163767/we-are-all-human-microphones-now?rel=emailNation

>

>

>

> gail zawacki <witsendnj@gmail.com> Oct 04 06:22PM -0400 ^

>

> The human mic, which is so patiently and tenderly transmitting different

> points of view, is one of the most moving things to witness at OWS.

>

> It is however, inefficient in larger crowds.

>

>

>

>

>  Topic: Direct Participatory Democratic Network - Where Revolution Streches

> in the Horizon

>

> "Richard S." <chardsinger@yahoo.com> Oct 04 02:19PM -0700 ^

>

> Although I am not an active participant or Liberty Plaza Park camper

> right now, I cannot resist answering some of the messages/ideas

> expressed on this e-mail list. If people feel I shouldn't be doing

> so, just let me know...

>

> Ale, I have two concerns when I read your description/message below.

> One is that in your idea about why we are marching (and I still can

> include myself in that "we" because I have been marching with many of

> you a lot of the time), you seem to have forgotten about the very

> crushing, real, concrete economic hardship that is being inflicted on

> so many of us, about the crisis of unemployment in a society in which

> employment is required - at least at some point - for survival (and is

> also used by many as a measure of one's worthiness to participate in

> society), and about the absurd inequality of our economic system. I

> thought inequality was one of the main reasons that we are marching.

> So, I am always baffled by your repeated insistence on dropping

> "egalite" from the "song" that you think we should chant.

>

> Secondly, I love the idea of general assemblies spreading throughout

> the world to practice and create direct participatory democracy.

> However, I hope that the concept of direct, participatory democracy

> being pursued does not have to include all the features of consensus

> process (or a particular kind of consensus process) that have been

> popular with activist groups for a while. (People who don't know say

> this is all new, but I know it isn't. When I first joined the GA, I

> was surprised at how many details and gimmicks in the process were

> identical to what I'd seen in Direct Action Network a dozen years

> ago.) My biggest fear in this area is with regard to the danger that

> consensus process has begun to be seen as a necessary ingredient in

> direct democracy (which it most certainly is not). I have heard that

> the GAs are really falling back on a form of majority voting pretty

> often anyway (is this true?), but I think that the emphasis on

> consensus, and the equation of many people (especially the newer

> activists) between consensus and "real democracy" would be a drag on

> the effectiveness and popularity of general assemblies in general. I

> am also concerned that the movement for democratic assemblies might be

> dragged down by the numerous gimmicks that are peculiar to this trend

> in process, but which I don't see as necessary - e.g., everything from

> "vibes watching" to certain identity-based concepts of the progressive

> stack to the twinkling of fingers (I don't mind "twinkling," I do it

> myself :) - but a lot of people don't see that as necessary at all).

>

> Because of time limits, I can't really comment adequately re. other

> thoughts that have occurred to me. However, I will add that I don't

> see all concerns related to all different "dissent social

> movements" (which is a broad enough category to be very changeable and

> debatable) as being "points" from which the social struggle and

> eventual revolution (I hope) to oppose and replace the present social-

> economic system can be waged with equal significance or

> effectiveness. (Hoping that sentence is not too convoluted, but

> again, my eloquence in this matter is limited by time, as I am a very

> slow writer.) And while I know this is a terrible heresy here and

> now, I do think that one "concern" and source of struggle that can

> unite the broadest range of people in a struggle against the root of

> our problems is class. I would say, "class" as a concept that can be

> debated, studied, updated beyond the usual stereotypical assumptions,

> but class nonetheless, based on people's economic role in the

> society. (Call me a dated old Marxist, if you like - though I was an

> anarchist activist first, well acquainted with these many supposedly

> "new" approaches a good number of years ago.)

>

> And, on a related point - or back to the first point - I also kind of

> thought we were marching to address issues of economic power and

> control that have been neglected by fashionable activist movements in

> our area for decades, which is one major reason we find ourselves in

> the present social disaster.

>

> Anyway, I hope this message has not been too cumbersome, and once

> again, if I am too detached from the group (at least in physical

> presence) to be offering such lengthy and somewhat dissenting

> opinions, you (all) should just tell me, and I will take that into

> major consideration. :)

>

> Richard

>

> On Oct 4, 3:36 pm, "Alexandre Machado De Sant'Anna Carvalho"

>

>

>

> Jon Good <therealjongood@gmail.com> Oct 04 05:32PM -0400 ^

>

> We need a one-line SOMETHING. I don't care if it's a demand, a definition,

> a purpose, or whatever, but we need a snappy, inspiring, and easily

> communicable idea so people can quickly understand what we're about. "We

> are a human struggle against oppression in all its forms" is a good start,

> but it's kind of a tounge-twister. I firmly believe we can come up with

> something of a similar sentiment that so simple, so universal, so

> immediately true that even my idiot cousin in the Tea Party will hear it and

> say "wow, that makes way more sense than this Tea Party shit" and come join

> this movement. A simple idea that can spread like wildfire.

>

>

> Solidarity,

>

> Jon

>

>

> *Tea Partiers themselves are not always bad people, they're just confused,

> angry, and so eager to do SOMETHING that they're grabbing onto the toxic

> messages of hatred that Big Business is packaging as a populist movement.

> It's exactly the same way that the fascists were able to take power in the

> 1930s: by appealing to the worst instincts of people. If we can figure out

> how to inspire people's best instincts instead, they will come to us in

> droves.

>

>

>

>

>

> On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 3:36 PM, Alexandre Machado De Sant'Anna Carvalho <

>

>

>

> Will Gauss <willgauss@gmail.com> Oct 04 05:42PM -0400 ^

>

> "True freedom for all people, forever."

>

> Sent from my iPhone

>

>

>

>

> Gabriel Johnson <gabjoh2@gmail.com> Oct 04 06:01PM -0400 ^

>

> Against the massive concentration of wealth and power in the hands of a

> select few.

>

> --glj

>

>

>

>

> gail zawacki <witsendnj@gmail.com> Oct 04 06:20PM -0400 ^

>

> I actually think any economic issues are wholly subsumed by environmental

> issues - you can't eat money - having said that, perhaps it's time for a

> movie break (even if it is mainly economic)!

>

> http://witsendnj.blogspot.com/2011/10/occupyeverywhere.html

>

>

>

>

>

>

>  Topic: OccupyWallStreet Economic Statement Draft 1

>

> shaista husain <shaistahusain@gmail.com> Oct 04 03:58PM -0400 ^

>

> Goals/demands/visions are all the same thing, it is a program, a collective

> consciousness and raison d'etre, some basic agreements of good faith between

> ourselves--there is much to celebrate here, unity is success. Now, this

> collective consciousness is not fixed but in transformation. We need NOT be

> afraid of demands/goals/visions/program, as we have already accomplished a

> major democratic feat : we have established that it will be a LIVING

> DOCUMENT; that it can by modified in time, elaborated upon, examined,

> clarified and worked out according to lessons collectively learned. We

> should begin to take ourselves in good faith and put forth a basic agenda,

> demands, etc, whatever we decide how little or how much, even if that is

> just posing certain questions to the media to the world, to address the

> public audience---our goal is to increase our base and support in the

> public, ie. grow in number--which we must do through our outreach. With this

> purpose in mind, using our own instruments of dissemination, we are quite

> capable of conveying tools of empowerment to the public at large--our

> success lies not only internal dialogue and diversity, but in our public

> support and its growth and further transformation.... open ended platform.

>

> One thing to always keep in mind, that is currently missing in our day to

> day program, is a sober examination of the international GA's, their lessons

> and their successes. We must stand together with international occupations,

> not only do they give us valuable tools, but also inform us on economic

> models for consideration. These alliances increase our constituency

> exponentially on a global level and also correct us from playing into

> american chauvinism, something that we all take for granted. WE MUST STAND

> in solidarity with global protest movements in the world. We are not alone.

> We need to address our economy in context of demands emerging from other

> occupations as well as our domestic crisis. This is what WALL STREET and the

> US WAR machine completely fails to do. This is where our goals and demands

> not only become meaningful on a national level, but in solidarity with other

> GAs we find that our solutions are not only really possible, completely

> feasible and rational, but they are in harmony with a future that must come

> to pass on this planet.

> One of the main goals of forming a working group on Economy and Global

> Democracy would be to ally ourselves and build bridges with other other

> occupations, exchange notes, present this to the body, also good tidings of

> victory as well as lessons mistakes crisis, we have 90 cities in the US to

> also ally ourselves with. All news of our brothers and sisters fighting

> under more austere more violent, more life and death situations so

> courageously, this gives us more power and legitimacy than any newspaper in

> the world. Let us reverberate globally in outrage and welcome all protest,

> reclaim our place in the world that has been hijacked by greedy warmongers,

> imperialists, who neither represent us nor profit us in any way and destroy

> movements for progress and democracy all across the earth. We are global

> democratic citizens. This is a global movement.

> Peace and Love,

> Shaista

>

>

>

>

> Cesar <wintersiroco@gmail.com> Oct 04 04:07PM -0400 ^

>

> I do not expect nothing but populist concesions. If they start to work for

> the people tomorrow, great, it will advance our goals, but our strategy is

> to grow our power.

> Cesar

>

>

> Sent from phone

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> gail zawacki <witsendnj@gmail.com> Oct 04 05:58PM -0400 ^

>

> But we aren't protesting one thing, like the Iraq war. If you look at

> photos of the signs people carry, their are multiple issues. I have argued

> that we could make the one demand - get corporate money out of politics -

> and many of the other issues would, and should, be resolved in a real

> democracy according to what the majority of the people want v. what will

> profit the plutocracy greatest.

>

> However there is quite a bit of resistance to boiling it all down to one

> demand on the part of some of the most active and passionate occupiers, and

> to allow it to be an evolving and organic process - and so I tend to think

> it's up to the press, like Matt T., to explain THAT position, rather than

> pressure OWS to capitulate.

>

>

>

>

>  Topic: Propaganda

>

> <frogman@networkpimps.com> Oct 04 05:48PM -0400 ^

>

> Here is another FOX News story that can have a negative impact. Who

> recruited Anonymous' involvement anyway?

>

> http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2011/10/04/hacker-group-anonymous-threatens-to-attack-stock-exchange/

>

>

>

> Lauren <celliwig@gmail.com> Oct 04 02:55PM -0700 ^

>

> Nobody did. They're acting on their own, the plan is stupid. I know

> the details of it and I'm pretty sure it's either a false flag op or

> something put together by a clueless group.

>

>

>

>

>  Topic: The PR company I told you was "representing" OWS Fwd: Workhouse PR

>

> jemcgloin@verizon.net Oct 04 04:27PM -0500 ^

>

> This sound sangerous to me also

>

> On 10/04/11, Doug Singsen<dougsingsen@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> +1

>

> Sent from my phone

>

> On Oct 4, 2011 8:19 AM, "Jon Good" <therealjongood@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> WTF? I appreciate that folks are eager to help, but I am very, very wary of

> this. It could be really nice to have their noise machine at our disposal,

> but in general, using the structures and systems of huge corporations

> presents a danger of this movement acting like corporation.

>

> Also, I'm fairly sure no entity can be the "official" anything of Occupy

> Wall Street without passing consensus in the GA.

>

> Public relations, generally, is about controlling peoples' perceptions and

> ideas about certain things. We shouldn't do this, because it's antithetical

> to participatory democracy. Moreover, we haven't defined ourselves or

> consensed upon demands, so any of their usual schtick would be hijacking the

> process of defining us.

>

> I would welcome their suggestions for strategies for reaching large numbers

> of people, and would welcome their considerable skills to talk us up in the

> media, but OWS is not their client and a corporate firm should probably not

> "represent" us in any sense of the word.

>

> Solidarity,

>

> Jon

>

> On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 2:20 AM, J Wedes <jwedes@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> Has anyone else from this list been in discussion with Workhouse PR? Just

> trying to understand if we are outsourcing "PR" work.

>

> -justin

>

> ---------- Forwarded message ----------

>

> From: RM <rebeccaction@gmail.com>

>

> Date: Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 2:14 AM

>

> Subject: Re: The PR company I told you was "representing" OWS Fwd: Workhouse

> PR

>

> To: J Wedes <jwedes@gmail.com>

>

> Certainly and of course! Please be sure to keep me in the loop going

> forward, thanks.

>

> -Rebecca

>

> On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 1:50 AM, J Wedes <jwedes@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> Hi Rebecca,

>

> Can I forward this info about Workhouse PR onto the september 17 listserv?

>

> I just want to make sure that everyone is aware of the conversations going

> on about PR.

>

> -justin

>

> On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 1:45 AM, RM <rebeccaction@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> Hi Justin,

>

> Nice to meet you briefly today.

>

> Here's a FW from my roommate, who runs the occupyinfo twitter account. He

> was contacted by Workhouse PR, which does work for big clients like Saks

> Fifth Avenue.

>

> He said they seemed well-intentioned and were volunteering their time.

> Here's a link to an article or two about this release to the media they did

> about Saturday's protests:

>

> http://www.nydailynews.com/gossip/2011/10/03/2011-10-03_occupy_wall_street_protesters_picked_up_by_public_relations_firm_workhouse_probo.html

>

> http://gawker.com/5846154/occupy-wall-street-gets-much+needed-help-from-pr-firm

>

> We should both be in touch with these folks, right?

>

> Would you do me a favor and cc: me on your correspondence? And I will do the

> same.

>

> Be well,

>

> -Rebecca

>

> ---------- Forwarded message ----------

>

> From: Rebecca Manski <rebaleh@gmail.com>

>

> Date: Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 10:55 PM

>

> Subject: Fwd: Workhouse PR

>

> To: rebeccaction@gmail.com

>

> ---------- Forwarded message ----------

>

> From: William Schwartz <will.js1@gmail.com>

>

> Date: Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 6:49 PM

>

> Subject: Re: Workhouse PR

>

> To: Rebecca Manski <rebaleh@gmail.com>

>

> Well they are volunteering their help. I just chatted them up on twitter.

> There was an article in the New York Post about it too.

>

> William Schwartz

>

> 917.385.5047

>

> Connect!

>

> http://twitter.com/2William

>

> On 3 October 2011 18:47, Rebecca Manski <rebaleh@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> Are you joking!

>

>

>

>

> jemcgloin@verizon.net Oct 04 04:36PM -0500 ^

>

> I actually think your stategy is backward. The way i see it first you get

> large numbers of people to join by showing how reasonable you are. Then when

> the numbers are big enough, they will feel their oats, get impatient, and

> start demanding more than you could have imagined. (Never underestimate mob

> mentality.) But if you talk about overthrowing governments, capitalism or

> wholesale changes, most of the 99% will be scared off, and we'll never have

> the power we need to affect real change. In order to fight the global

> coporations I estimate we need a minimum of 15 million Americans on the

> street. There are not 15 million radical socialist/anarchists in the US. We

> need people without political agendas, but with anger at coporations.

>

> I am also wary of using PR firms, by the way. (Athough the fact that anyone

> can call and be a "spokesman" shows one of our weaknesses.)

>

> On 10/04/11, Snafu<snafu@thething.it> wrote:

>

> Just heard a guy at the Brian Lehrer Show on WNYC, who called in as an OWS

> "spokesperson" and claimed to be "in charge of security at the park." The

> radio show was about how Wall Street traders and workers feel about the

> occupation. He said that he wanted the radio conversation to happen in the

> square (on which I can agree) and then added that OWS is not about class

> warfare but about getting things done and bringing about change. The overall

> tone was that of a reassuring middle-class guy speaking to middle America.

>

> While this communicative style may help expand our ranks, it will also help

> change the social composition of the movement in such a way that if any

> reforms are ever passed, they will be probably so watered-down that they

> will change in fact nothing. I am not sure how spokespersons are selected

> and whether this guy (who claimed to have appeared on several TV programs as

> well) has anything to do with the PR firm mentioned in this thread.

>

> But I want to raise the point that this way of communicating can have

> serious political consequences, some of which may not be that desirable. I

> think we should try and select spokespersons who are able to express a more

> radical point of view in a reasonable way.

>

> On 10/4/11 9:25 AM, Doug Singsen wrote:

>

> +1

>

> Sent from my phone

>

> On Oct 4, 2011 8:19 AM, "Jon Good" <therealjongood@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> WTF? I appreciate that folks are eager to help, but I am very, very wary of

> this. It could be really nice to have their noise machine at our disposal,

> but in general, using the structures and systems of huge corporations

> presents a danger of this movement acting like corporation.

>

> Also, I'm fairly sure no entity can be the "official" anything of Occupy

> Wall Street without passing consensus in the GA.

>

> Public relations, generally, is about controlling peoples' perceptions and

> ideas about certain things. We shouldn't do this, because it's antithetical

> to participatory democracy. Moreover, we haven't defined ourselves or

> consensed upon demands, so any of their usual schtick would be hijacking the

> process of defining us.

>

> I would welcome their suggestions for strategies for reaching large numbers

> of people, and would welcome their considerable skills to talk us up in the

> media, but OWS is not their client and a corporate firm should probably not

> "represent" us in any sense of the word.

>

> Solidarity,

>

> Jon

>

> On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 2:20 AM, J Wedes <jwedes@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> Has anyone else from this list been in discussion with Workhouse PR? Just

> trying to understand if we are outsourcing "PR" work.

>

> -justin

>

> ---------- Forwarded message ----------

>

> From: RM <rebeccaction@gmail.com>

>

> Date: Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 2:14 AM

>

> Subject: Re: The PR company I told you was "representing" OWS Fwd: Workhouse

> PR

>

> To: J Wedes <jwedes@gmail.com>

>

> Certainly and of course! Please be sure to keep me in the loop going

> forward, thanks.

>

> -Rebecca

>

> On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 1:50 AM, J Wedes <jwedes@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> Hi Rebecca,

>

> Can I forward this info about Workhouse PR onto the september 17 listserv?

>

> I just want to make sure that everyone is aware of the conversations going

> on about PR.

>

> -justin

>

> On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 1:45 AM, RM <rebeccaction@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> Hi Justin,

>

> Nice to meet you briefly today.

>

> Here's a FW from my roommate, who runs the occupyinfo twitter account. He

> was contacted by Workhouse PR, which does work for big clients like Saks

> Fifth Avenue.

>

> He said they seemed well-intentioned and were volunteering their time.

> Here's a link to an article or two about this release to the media they did

> about Saturday's protests:

>

> http://www.nydailynews.com/gossip/2011/10/03/2011-10-03_occupy_wall_street_protesters_picked_up_by_public_relations_firm_workhouse_probo.html

>

> http://gawker.com/5846154/occupy-wall-street-gets-much+needed-help-from-pr-firm

>

> We should both be in touch with these folks, right?

>

> Would you do me a favor and cc: me on your correspondence? And I will do the

> same.

>

> Be well,

>

> -Rebecca

>

> ---------- Forwarded message ----------

>

> From: Rebecca Manski <rebaleh@gmail.com>

>

> Date: Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 10:55 PM

>

> Subject: Fwd: Workhouse PR

>

> To: rebeccaction@gmail.com

>

> ---------- Forwarded message ----------

>

> From: William Schwartz <will.js1@gmail.com>

>

> Date: Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 6:49 PM

>

> Subject: Re: Workhouse PR

>

> To: Rebecca Manski <rebaleh@gmail.com>

>

> Well they are volunteering their help. I just chatted them up on twitter.

> There was an article in the New York Post about it too.

>

> William Schwartz

>

> 917.385.5047

>

> Connect!

>

> http://twitter.com/2William

>

> On 3 October 2011 18:47, Rebecca Manski <rebaleh@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> Are you joking!

>

>

>

>

> jemcgloin@verizon.net Oct 04 04:37PM -0500 ^

>

> +1

>

> On 10/04/11, Will Gauss<willgauss@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> To protect us from people lying about representing us, put to a vote at the

> GA today that we make a blanket statement informing the media that no

> company speaks for us and to reject any speaker who claims otherwise as a

> liar.

>

> Then, form a working group to select -individuals- who are authorized to

> speak for us.

>

> Sent from my iPhone

>

> On Oct 4, 2011, at 10:55 AM, Micah White <micahmwhite@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> Beware of corporate co-optation in all its guises. They want to "help" #OWS

> for a reason.

>

> To maintain our authenticity we must reject all corporate influence. We must

> not become a corporate sponsored movement.

>

> On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 7:51 AM, Snafu <snafu@thething.it> wrote:

>

> Just heard a guy at the Brian Lehrer Show on WNYC, who called in as an OWS

> "spokesperson" and claimed to be "in charge of security at the park." The

> radio show was about how Wall Street traders and workers feel about the

> occupation. He said that he wanted the radio conversation to happen in the

> square (on which I can agree) and then added that OWS is not about class

> warfare but about getting things done and bringing about change. The overall

> tone was that of a reassuring middle-class guy speaking to middle America.

>

> While this communicative style may help expand our ranks, it will also help

> change the social composition of the movement in such a way that if any

> reforms are ever passed, they will be probably so watered-down that they

> will change in fact nothing. I am not sure how spokespersons are selected

> and whether this guy (who claimed to have appeared on several TV programs as

> well) has anything to do with the PR firm mentioned in this thread.

>

> But I want to raise the point that this way of communicating can have

> serious political consequences, some of which may not be that desirable. I

> think we should try and select spokespersons who are able to express a more

> radical point of view in a reasonable way.

>

> On 10/4/11 9:25 AM, Doug Singsen wrote:

>

> +1

>

> Sent from my phone

>

> On Oct 4, 2011 8:19 AM, "Jon Good" <therealjongood@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> WTF? I appreciate that folks are eager to help, but I am very, very wary of

> this. It could be really nice to have their noise machine at our disposal,

> but in general, using the structures and systems of huge corporations

> presents a danger of this movement acting like corporation.

>

> Also, I'm fairly sure no entity can be the "official" anything of Occupy

> Wall Street without passing consensus in the GA.

>

> Public relations, generally, is about controlling peoples' perceptions and

> ideas about certain things. We shouldn't do this, because it's antithetical

> to participatory democracy. Moreover, we haven't defined ourselves or

> consensed upon demands, so any of their usual schtick would be hijacking the

> process of defining us.

>

> I would welcome their suggestions for strategies for reaching large numbers

> of people, and would welcome their considerable skills to talk us up in the

> media, but OWS is not their client and a corporate firm should probably not

> "represent" us in any sense of the word.

>

> Solidarity,

>

> Jon

>

> On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 2:20 AM, J Wedes <jwedes@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> Has anyone else from this list been in discussion with Workhouse PR? Just

> trying to understand if we are outsourcing "PR" work.

>

> -justin

>

> ---------- Forwarded message ----------

>

> From: RM <rebeccaction@gmail.com>

>

> Date: Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 2:14 AM

>

> Subject: Re: The PR company I told you was "representing" OWS Fwd: Workhouse

> PR

>

> To: J Wedes <jwedes@gmail.com>

>

> Certainly and of course! Please be sure to keep me in the loop going

> forward, thanks.

>

> -Rebecca

>

> On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 1:50 AM, J Wedes <jwedes@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> Hi Rebecca,

>

> Can I forward this info about Workhouse PR onto the september 17 listserv?

>

> I just want to make sure that everyone is aware of the conversations going

> on about PR.

>

> -justin

>

> On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 1:45 AM, RM <rebeccaction@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> Hi Justin,

>

> Nice to meet you briefly today.

>

> Here's a FW from my roommate, who runs the occupyinfo twitter account. He

> was contacted by Workhouse PR, which does work for big clients like Saks

> Fifth Avenue.

>

> He said they seemed well-intentioned and were volunteering their time.

> Here's a link to an article or two about this release to the media they did

> about Saturday's protests:

>

> http://www.nydailynews.com/gossip/2011/10/03/2011-10-03_occupy_wall_street_protesters_picked_up_by_public_relations_firm_workhouse_probo.html

>

> http://gawker.com/5846154/occupy-wall-street-gets-much+needed-help-from-pr-firm

>

> We should both be in touch with these folks, right?

>

> Would you do me a favor and cc: me on your correspondence? And I will do the

> same.

>

> Be well,

>

> -Rebecca

>

> ---------- Forwarded message ----------

>

> From: Rebecca Manski <rebaleh@gmail.com>

>

> Date: Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 10:55 PM

>

> Subject: Fwd: Workhouse PR

>

> To: rebeccaction@gmail.com

>

> ---------- Forwarded message ----------

>

> From: William Schwartz <will.js1@gmail.com>

>

> Date: Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 6:49 PM

>

> Subject: Re: Workhouse PR

>

> To: Rebecca Manski <rebaleh@gmail.com>

>

> Well they are volunteering their help. I just chatted them up on twitter.

> There was an article in the New York Post about it too.

>

> William Schwartz

>

> 917.385.5047

>

> Connect!

>

> http://twitter.com/2William

>

> On 3 October 2011 18:47, Rebecca Manski <rebaleh@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> Are you joking!

>

>

>

>

>  Topic: persons running wearethe99percent.tumblr.com

>

> Micah White <micahmwhite@gmail.com> Oct 04 02:25PM -0700 ^

>

> Can the persons running http://wearethe99percent.tumblr.com/ please email me

> off-list. We are getting contacted by journalists who want to speak with

> you.

>

> (By the way, I think you should win a webby - it is a wonderful site!)

>

> Thanks,

>

> Micah

>

>

>

>  Topic: Welcome Flyer

>

> jemcgloin@verizon.net Oct 04 04:23PM -0500 ^

>

> Very cool, maybe a quick run through of general assembly prodedures and how

> to find a working group?

>

> On 10/04/11, J Wedes<jwedes@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> Hi everyone,

>

> I know we have a NYC GA pamphlet, but I wanted to create something that we

> could give to new campers upon arrival at the Welcome Centers.

>

> Here's my start on it:

> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Ql4xnJO1y5kChYhoSCDDImMZZkPSvycCovhGGCb0BNM/edit?hl=en_US

>

> It lays out basic rules, info about the park/neighborhood/etc. It is by no

> means exhaustive, but it's a start.

>

> What do people think?

>

> -justin

>

>

>

>  Topic: Wall Street is War Street: Antiwar rally on Sat, Oct 15 moved to OWS

>

> Doug Singsen <dougsingsen@gmail.com> Oct 04 04:20PM -0400 ^

>

> It was originally going to be targeted at 3 embassies in Midtown, but the

> United National Antiwar Committee (UNAC) voted to move it downtown.

>

> *Wall Street Is War Street*

>

> *On the 10th Anniversary of U.S. War in Afghanistan*

>

> *NO to Endless WARS!*****

>

> *Sat. OCT. 15**,*

>

> *Noon Rally at Wall Street*

>

> *March to Occupy Wall Street Encampment*

>

> *Liberty & Broadway*

>

> * *

>

> *Oct. 15 is a day of nationally coordinated antiwar actions in cities across

> the U.S., the 10th anniversary of the massively destructive and criminal

> U.S. war on Afghanistan.*

>

> ** **

>

> When the U.S. government began its attack on Afghanistan 10 years ago,

> President Bush called it a “war on terror.” It was followed by 8 years of

> U.S. war Iraq and now war in Libya and drone wars on Pakistan, Yemen,

> Somalia and Sudan under Pres. Obama. These are all wars for oil, resources

> and markets in the interests of corporate power.****

>

> At the same time, the U.S. government is carrying out attacks on working

> people within the U.S., cutting back on health care and education while

> bailing out the Wall St. banks and insurance companies. Every time people

> call for money for social services, we are told there is no money, but the

> government always finds money for its wars. It is increasing repression on

> Muslims, on Black and Latino youth and on those who protest, as the FBI

> raids on anti-war demonstrators and the NYPD attacks on the peaceful Occupy

> Wall St. demonstrators show.****

>

> Join us in a march to demand an end to U.S. wars in Afghanistan & Iraq, an

> end to U.S. aid to Israel, and an end to U.S. bombing and destruction in

> Libya and an end to the growing repression at home.****

>

> *We NEED*****

>

> *Jobs, Health Care & Education*****

>

> *NOT*****

>

> *War, Racism & Repression*

>

> *--------------------------------*****

>

> Followed by a *4 pm Solidarity Meeting* with Carlos Montes, a speaker from

> the Victor Toro Defense Committee, immigrant rights and antiwar activists

> facing government attack and phony charges, and Cyrus McGoldrick from the NY

> Council on American Islamic Relations.****

>

> *At Judson Memorial Church, Washington Square South & Thompson St., NYC*

>

> Called by: United National Antiwar Coalition (UNAC),

> www.UNACpeace.org<http://www.unacpeace.org/>

>

>

>

> Doug Singsen <dougsingsen@gmail.com> Oct 04 04:24PM -0400 ^

>

> BTW, this is marking the tenth anniversary of the invasion of Afghanistan,

> which is also the start date for the October2011 occupation in Washington,

> DC, which starts on Thursday. The NYC march was moved back a week from the

> anniversary date so it wouldn't conflict with the DC occupation.

>

>

>

>

> shaista husain <shaistahusain@gmail.com> Oct 04 04:29PM -0400 ^

>

> Great how show of support from UNAC

>

>

>

>

> Doug Singsen <dougsingsen@gmail.com> Oct 04 04:31PM -0400 ^

>

> UNAC is also an endorser/participant in the DC occupation.

>

>

>

>

> lisajensky@gmail.com Oct 04 08:37PM ^

>

> This is great!

>

> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Doug Singsen <dougsingsen@gmail.com>

> Sender: september17@googlegroups.com

> Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2011 16:31:37

> To: <september17@googlegroups.com>

> Reply-To: september17@googlegroups.com

> Subject: Re: [september17discuss] Re: Wall Street is War Street: Antiwar

> rally

> on Sat, Oct 15 moved to OWS

>

> UNAC is also an endorser/participant in the DC occupation.

>

>

>

>

>  Topic: Miami Herald - Phone interview - TODAY

>

> Vicente Rubio <vrubiopu@gmail.com> Oct 04 04:06PM -0400 ^

>

> A Miami Herald jounalist is looking for a Latinamerican OWS organizer to

> interview by phone asap. Please write to moralesisa@gmail.com.

>

> 2011/10/4 Yotam Marom <yotam.marom@gmail.com>

>

>

>

>

> grimwomyn <grimwomyn@gmail.com> Oct 04 04:23PM -0400 ^

>

> I am puerto rican raised in tennessee if that fits anywhere?

>

>>> Hi friends.

>

>>> I wrote a piece about the occupation. Figured I'd put it up here in case

>>> people find it useful in some way.

>

> http://www.zcommunications.org/a-brief-analysis-from-a-wall-street-occupier-by-yotam-marom

>

>

>

>  Topic: URGENT: Safer Spaces and Non-violence

>

> Sarah <miss.quintessential01@gmail.com> Oct 03 10:59PM -0400 ^

>

> Thank you SO MUCH for addressing this. I'm looking forward to hearing back

> from the meeting, and will see what I can do to help maintain a a truly

> safer space at OWS.

>

> Best,

> Sarah

>

>

>

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