|From:||L. W. Wind <firstname.lastname@example.org>|
|Sent time:||Thursday, September 29, 2011 9:06:51 AM|
|Subject:||Re: [september17discuss] Re: can we try to come up with one demand?|
Even the failure of accomplishing a specific demand that would have benefited pretty much all of the 99% would be a victory, if you add in time. Because a lot of people don't really know what they want until they see someone trying to get it. That 900 shared that MJ article is a sign from the left: "Pick something!"Re: demands and revolutions: you're right, as far as I know. The demand must be specific enough to force the other side to show their hand. One demand, any strong, specific demand, like forgiving student debt or ending foreclosures, is what the establishment fears the most. Because even if 2% of the population took it on as their own, it would be enough to start a snowball rolling down a hill of more and more empowered, awakened people. The world's Superpower is different than Egypt or Syria. We have a lot to fix! It's a very big boat and its huge turning radius demands our own set of tactics if we're going to turn it around. That big wheel must be gripped tight and pulled, eyes locked with the Captain, until more and more rush to start pulling, and even if it only turns a tick, it is a victory of The People. We haven't had one of those in a while.Otherwise, we're just shouting about how it needs to be turned.Keep the list of demands you've worked so hard for, shout them from the rooftops and lay the foundation for the huge uprising that will come if we assert our power now by picking a demand and not letting go.I wonder if occupiers could see the one demand as a act of humility and solidarity. Maybe put out a runoff ballot, and vow to honor the demand that comes out of it. Shared sacrifice and democracy. I don't know anyone who could bash that.
On Thu, Sep 29, 2011 at 8:20 AM, Jackie DiSalvo <email@example.com> wrote:
From: firstname.lastname@example.org [mailto:email@example.com] On Behalf Of Doug Singsen
Sent: Thursday, September 29, 2011 10:11 AM
Subject: Re: [september17discuss] Re: can we try to come up with one demand?
First, no revolution in history has ever taken place that didn't have demands. This opposition between demands and revolution has got to stop. The two go hand in hand. Second, there are tons of demands we can raise that would help the working class and the poor, beginning with taxing Wall Street to pay for social services. Third, let's be realistic about the prospects for revolution. I support the overthrow of capitalism, but we are nowhere near a revolution in the US right now, and demanding a revolution now is a quick way to isolate ourselves from the huge numbers of people who support reducing corporate power and taxing Wall Street but aren't ready for a revolution.
On Thu, Sep 29, 2011 at 7:24 AM, Justine <firstname.lastname@example.org> wrote:
Agreed Drew. The "one demand" thing is such a red herring and I can't wait for this discussion to finally go away. Our job is to help the people rise up, not to have a privileged white middle class discussion about how we should ask the government should "fix" itself through abstract financial reform. I want a revolution, not another broken promise from a corrupt government.
The only demand I've heard so far at the GA that I felt I could get behind went something like this: Rather than demanding something from the 1%, we should make a demand of the 99%. We demand that the 99% start forming general assemblies in their own communities. We demand that the 99% organize to take back the world stolen from them by the 1%.
This demand is also similar to what we published on the 17th: https://occupywallst.org/article/September_Revolution/
On Thu, Sep 29, 2011 at 2:23 AM, Drew <email@example.com> wrote:
Lets forget about the demand and promote what this movement already is.
We are building the community we WANT in this world. One that feeds, shelters (if we could...), and cares for all it's members. A community that hears every voice.
Lets focus on making our community exactly what we want, sustainable, open, free, and full of love. What better demand is there than showing the world what is possible even inside the heart of darkness.
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